Daytime Meeting - Sessional Day 33
Evening Meeting - Sessional Day 34
Lundi
17 juin 2002
Séance de l'après-midi - jour de session 33
Séance du soir - jour de session 34
3rd Session,
37th Parliament
3e session
37e législature
PRAYERS
1:30 P.M.
PRIÈRES
13 H 30
Mr. Tsubouchi delivered to the
Speaker a message from His Honour the Lieutenant Governor signed
by his own hand, and the said message was read by the Speaker and
is as follows:-
James K. Bartleman
The Lieutenant Governor
transmits Estimates of certain sums required for the services of
the Province for the year ending 31st March 2003 and recommends
them to the Legislative Assembly.
Le lieutenant-gouverneur
transmet les prévisions de certains montants
nécessaires pour assurer les services de la province pour
l'exercice se terminant le 31 mars 2003 et les recommande à
l'Assemblée législative.
Toronto, 17th June
2002
Toronto, le 17 juin
2002
(Sessional Paper No. 3,
Agriculture and Food; Attorney General; Cabinet Office;
Citizenship; Community, Family and Children's Services; Consumer
and Business Services; Culture; Education; Enterprise,
Opportunity and Innovation; Environment and Energy; Finance;
Office of Francophone Affairs; Health and Long-Term Care;
Intergovernmental Affairs; Labour; Office of the Lieutenant
Governor; Management Board Secretariat; Municipal Affairs and
Housing; Ontario Native Affairs Secretariat; Natural Resources;
Northern Development and Mines; Office of the Premier; Public
Safety and Security; Tourism and Recreation; Training, Colleges
and Universities; Transportation).
Agriculture et Alimentation;
Procureur général; Bureau du Conseil des ministres;
Affaires civiques; Services à la collectivité, à
la famille et à l'enfance; Services aux consommateurs et aux
enterprises; Culture; Éducation; Enterprise,
Débouchés et Innovation; Environnement et Énergie;
Finances; Offices des affaires francophones; Santé et Soins
de longue durée; Affaires intergouvernementales; Travail;
Bureau du Lieutenant-gouverneur; Secrétariat du Conseil de
gestion; Affaires municipales et Logement; Secrétariat des
affaires autochtones de l'Ontario; Richesses naturelles;
Développement du Nord et des Mines; Cabinet du Premier
ministre; Sûreté et Sécurité publique;
Tourisme et Loisirs; Formation, Collèges et
Universités; Transports).
Ordered, That the message of the
Lieutenant Governor together with the Estimates accompanying same
be deemed to be referred to the Standing Committee on Estimates
pursuant to Standing Order 58.
INTRODUCTION OF
BILLS
DÉPÔT DES PROJETS
DE LOI
The following Bill was
introduced, read the first time and referred to the Standing
Committee on Regulations and Private Bills:-
Le projet de loi suivant est
présenté, lu une première fois et
déféré au Comité permanent des
règlements et des projets de loi d'intérêt
privé:-
Bill Pr8, An Act to revive
1397399 Ontario Inc. Mr. O'Toole.
The Speaker delivered the
following ruling:-
On Monday, June 10, the Member
for Niagara Centre (Mr. Kormos) raised a point of privilege
concerning statements made to the press by the Premier, and to
the press and in this House by the Minister of Energy, relating
to executive compensation at Hydro One Inc.
The Member contended that
apparent contradictions between statements on this subject by the
Premier and by the Minister, and other apparent contradictions
between statements made by the Minister on different occasions,
left room for one to draw the conclusion that the Minister had
exhibited a lack of forthrightness when addressing the House. As
a result, the Member invited me to find the Minister to be,
prima facie, in contempt of the Legislature.
The Minister of Energy also
briefly addressed the point of privilege, and insistently
discounted the validity of the Member's contentions.
I have reviewed the material
supplied by the Member for Niagara Centre, together with the
relevant authorities and precedents and am prepared to deliver my
ruling.
As the Member for Niagara Centre
pointed out, Erskine May, at page 111 of the 22nd
Edition under the title "Misconduct of Members or Officers"
states "The Commons may treat the making of a deliberately
misleading statement as a contempt." This citation however goes
on further than the Member quoted to provide reference to one of
the most famous such cases in parliamentary history, that of
British Cabinet Minister John Dennis Profumo, who knowingly
avowed one thing to the House of Commons which was later proved
conclusively, and admitted by Profumo, to be untrue. An essential
component of this case is that Profumo deliberately set out, in a
prepared statement, to purposely mislead the House, and then did
so.
The threshold for finding a
prima facie case of contempt against a Member of the
Legislature, on the basis of deliberately misleading the House,
is therefore set quite high and is very uncommon. It must involve
a proved finding of an overt attempt to intentionally mislead the
Legislature. In the absence of an admission from the Member
accused of the conduct, or of tangible confirmation of the
conduct, independently proved, a Speaker must assume that no
honourable Members would engage in such behaviour or that, at
most, inconsistent statements were the result of inadvertence or
honest mistake.
On this point, I would ask all
Members to be extremely vigilant about the statements they make
in this House. Despite the cut-and-thrust and understandable
emotion of Question Periods and debates, those statements are
held up to the highest possible scrutiny by all observers of this
place and, as their statements represent the personal integrity
of each Member, they must withstand inspection.
I now want to address the Member
for Niagara Centre's citation of a recent ruling by Speaker
Milliken in the House of Commons of Canada regarding statements
made by then-Minister of National Defence, Art
Eggleton.
I am deeply reluctant to accord
applicability of that ruling to this case. Firstly, in that case
Mr. Eggleton concurred that contradictory statements had been
made and that clarification of the reasons for this, in a
suitable forum, was required. Secondly, I see no precedential
value to Speaker Milliken's ruling - within the ambit of
parliamentary privilege - since, if the ruling is carefully read,
it becomes apparent that a prima facie case of privilege
was not explicitly found. Rather, Speaker Milliken seems to have
stopped himself short in that regard and chose instead a novel
approach, finding ultimately - without mentioning privilege -
that the matter deserved consideration by a committee, and
inviting a motion to give effect to this result.
I would generally be hesitant to
appropriate for myself such an original, informal approach since
the precedents, traditions and customs of this House around
questions of privilege reveal a more definitive tendency. In my
view, there are no shades of grey when it comes to parliamentary
privilege and I would not like to promote such a view by
delivering a ruling that failed to address, squarely and solely
on its procedural merits, the question raised.
In the case at hand raised by
the Member for Niagara Centre, I can only find that I am left
with what amounts to a genuine disagreement between 2 honourable
Members. As a result, I am unable to find that a prima
facie case of contempt has been made out.
Finally, I want to thank the
Member for Niagara Centre for the respect and careful choice of
words he exhibited when he addressed this matter.
MOTIONS
MOTIONS
Mr. Stockwell moved,
M. Stockwell propose,
That pursuant to Standing Order
9(c)(i), the House shall meet from 6:45 p.m. to 9:30 p.m. on
Monday, June 17, Tuesday, June 18, Wednesday, June 19 and
Thursday, June 20, 2002, for the purpose of considering
government business.
The question being put on the
motion, it was carried on the following division:-
La motion, mise aux voix, est
adoptée par le vote suivant:-
AYES / POUR -
71
Agostino
Arnott
Baird
Barrett
Bartolucci
Beaubien
Bountrogianni
Boyer
Bradley
Caplan
Christopherson
Chudleigh
Clark
Clement
Coburn
Colle
Crozier
Cunningham
Curling
DeFaria
Di Cocco
Dombrowsky
Elliott
Flaherty
Galt
Gill
Gravelle
Hardeman
Hastings
Hodgson
Hoy
Hudak
Johns
Johnson
Kells
Klees
Kwinter
Lalonde
Levac
Martiniuk
Mazzilli
McDonald
McLeod
McMeekin
Miller
Molinari
Munro
Mushinski
Newman
O'Toole
Ouellette
Parsons
Peters
Pupatello
Ramsay
Runciman
Ruprecht
Sampson
Sergio
Smitherman
Spina
Sterling
Stockwell
Tascona
Tsubouchi
Turnbull
Wettlaufer
Wilson
Witmer
Wood
Young
NAYS / CONTRE -
6
Bisson
Churley
Kormos
Marchese
Martin
Prue
PETITIONS
PÉTITIONS
Petition relating to Fair rent
increases (Sessional Paper No. P-4) Mr. Caplan.
Petition relating to Cost of
living increase to the recipients of benefits through the Ontario
Disability Support Program (Sessional Paper No. P-5) Mr.
Bisson.
Petitions relating to Amendments
to the Ontario Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals
Act (Sessional Paper No. P-12) Mr. Bradley and Mr.
Curling.
Petition relating to Hamilton's
Central Ambulance Communication Centre (Sessional Paper No. P-16)
Mr. Bradley.
Petition relating to Closing the
cardiac surgery services at Children's Hospital of Eastern
Ontario (Sessional Paper No. P-36) Mrs. Boyer.
Petition relating to the
Implementation of a safe water action plan (Sessional Paper No.
P-49) Mr. Sergio.
Petition relating to Highway 522
(Sessional Paper No. P-51) Mr. O'Toole.
Petition relating to Sexually
explicit material exposed to minors (Sessional Paper No. 54) Mr.
Wood.
ORDERS OF THE
DAY
ORDRE DU JOUR
With unanimous consent, at 3:25
p.m., the sitting was suspended until 4:00 p.m.
Mrs. Ecker moved, seconded by
Mr. Eves, That this House approves in general the Budgetary
Policy of the Government, and in doing so presented her 2002
Budget and Budget papers / Budget de l'Ontario de 2002 et les
Documents budgétaires (Sessional Paper No. 2).
And a debate having ensued, it
was,
Un débat s'ensuit
et,
On motion by Mr.
Duncan,
Sur la motion de M.
Duncan,
Ordered, That the debate be
adjourned.
Il est ordonné que le
débat soit ajourné.
Pursuant to S.O. 57(a), the
House reverted to "Introduction of Bills".
Conformément à
l'article 57(a), l'Assemblée revient à l'appel de
«Dépôt des projets de loi».
The following Bill was
introduced and read for the first time:-
Le projet de loi suivant et
présenté et lu une première fois:-
Bill 109, An Act to implement
the measures contained in the 2002 Ontario Budget and to
implement other initiatives of the Government of Ontario. Hon.
Mrs. Ecker.
Projet de loi 109, Loi mettant
en oeuvre certaines mesures énoncées dans le budget de
l'Ontario de 2002 ainsi que d'autres initiatives du gouvernement
ontarien. L'hon Mme Ecker.
Mr. Stockwell moved, That the
House do now adjourn.
M. Stockwell propose que
l'Assemblée ajourne les débats maintenant.
The question, having been put on
the motion, was declared carried.
Cette motion, mise aux voix, est
declarée adoptée.
The House then adjourned at 5:14
p.m.
À 17 h 14, la chambre a
ensuite ajourné ses travaux.
6:45 P.M.
18 H 45
ORDERS OF THE
DAY
ORDRE DU JOUR
Debate was resumed on the motion
for Second Reading of Bill 80, An Act respecting directors and
officers of Hydro One Inc. and its subsidiaries.
Le débat reprend sur la
motion portant deuxième lecture du projet de loi 80, Loi
concernant les administrateurs et les dirigeants de Hydro One
Inc. et de ses filiales.
After some time, pursuant to
Standing Order 9(a), the motion for adjournment of the debate was
deemed to have been made and carried.
Après quelque temps,
conformément à l'article 9(a) du Règlement, la
motion d'ajournement du débat est réputée avoir
été proposée et adoptée.
The House then adjourned at 9:30
p.m.
À 21 h 30, la chambre a
ensuite ajourné ses travaux.
le président
GARY CARR
Speaker
SESSIONAL PAPERS PRESENTED
PURSUANT TO STANDING ORDER 39(A):-
DOCUMENTS PARLEMENTAIRES
DÉPOSÉS CONFORMÉMENT À L'ARTICLE 39(A) DU
RÈGLEMENT
Compendia:
Bill 109, An Act to implement
the measures contained in the 2002 Ontario Budget and to
implement other initiatives of the Government of Ontario. (No.
22).
Part-time appointments re
intended Order-in-Council dated June 12, 2002 (No. 21) (Tabled
June 14, 2002).
