CONTENTS
Monday 14 November 1994
Planning and Municipal Statute Law Amendment Act, 1994, Bill 163, Mr Philip / Loi de 1994 modifiant des lois en ce qui concerne l'aménagement du territoire et les municipalités,
projet de loi 163, M. Philip
STANDING COMMITTEE ON ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE
*Chair / Président: Marchese, Rosario (Fort York ND)
*Vice-Chair / Vice-Président: Harrington, Margaret H. (Niagara Falls ND)
*Bisson, Gilles (Cochrane South/-Sud ND)
Chiarelli, Robert (Ottawa West/-Ouest L)
*Curling, Alvin (Scarborough North/-Nord L)
*Haeck, Christel (St Catharines-Brock ND)
Harnick, Charles (Willowdale PC)
Malkowski, Gary (York East/-Est ND)
Murphy, Tim (St George-St David L)
Tilson, David (Dufferin-Peel PC)
*Wilson, Gary (Kingston and The Islands/Kingston et Les Iles ND)
Winninger, David (London South/-Sud ND)
*In attendance / présents
Substitutions present/ Membres remplaçants présents:
Eddy, Ron (Brant-Haldimand L) for Mr Murphy
Hayes, Pat (Essex-Kent ND) for Mr Malkowski
McLean, Allan K. (Simcoe East/-Est PC) for Mr Tilson
Stockwell, Chris (Etobicoke West/-Ouest PC) for Mr Harnick
White, Drummond (Durham Centre ND) for Ms Harrington
Wiseman, Jim (Durham West/-Ouest ND) for Mr Winninger
Also taking part / Autres participants et participantes:
Ministry of Municipal Affairs:
Hayes, Pat, parliamentary assistant to minister
McKinstry, Philip, acting director, municipal planning policy branch
Clerk / Greffière: Bryce, Donna
Staff / Personnel: Mifsud, Lucinda, legislative counsel
The committee met at 1526 in room 228.
PLANNING AND MUNICIPAL STATUTE LAW AMENDMENT ACT, 1994 / LOI DE 1994 MODIFIANT DES LOIS EN CE QUI CONCERNE L'AMÉNAGEMENT DU TERRITOIRE ET DES MUNICIPALITÉS
Consideration of Bill 163, An Act to revise the Ontario Planning and Development Act and the Municipal Conflict of Interest Act, to amend the Planning Act and the Municipal Act and to amend other statutes related to planning and municipal matters / Projet de loi 163, Loi révisant la Loi sur la planification et l'aménagement du territoire de l'Ontario, la Loi sur les conflits d'intérêts municipaux, et modifiant la Loi sur l'aménagement du territoire et la Loi sur les municipalités et modifiant d'autres lois touchant des questions relatives à l'aménagement et aux municipalités.
The Chair (Mr Rosario Marchese): I call the meeting to order. Mr Hayes has a motion.
Mr Pat Hayes (Essex-Kent): Thank you, Mr Chair. What I want to do is ask for an agreement by the committee to bring forward amendments on page 162, section 37.1; page 180, section 52; page 186, section 57.1; and page 189, section 62.1, in order that unanimous consent may be given to deem them in order.
Mr Jim Wiseman (Durham West): Agreed.
Mr Allan K. McLean (Simcoe East): Well, just a minute. Have you got a copy of what he was just talking about? I'd like you to show me the page where these amendments are that you're reading off. I mean, we're not just all sitting here like dummies.
Mr Hayes: I don't want you to be that way, Mr McLean.
The Chair: That's fair, Mr McLean. Mr Hayes will find it.
Interjections.
The Chair: Please, a bit of order. We're trying to move this along.
Mr Hayes: I think Mr McLean's got a legitimate concern. Page 162 is the first one.
Mr McLean: Of which book?
Mr Hayes: Of our big book, our book of motions.
Mr McLean: Okay. So that's government motion number 162?
Mr Hayes: Yes. The next one is on page 180, and the one after that is --
The Chair: Give him a chance. He wants to look at them.
Mr Hayes: Sorry. Page 162: You've got that one? That pertains to fines. Page 180, section 52, is the Trees Act. Page 186, section 57.1, is the Condominium Act. Page 189, section 62.1, is the Lakes and Rivers Improvement Act.
The Chair: Mr McLean, I suppose you are considering this matter. Is that what's happening?
Mr McLean: Yes, I am. To the parliamentary assistant, section 52 of the bill, section 223.2 of the Municipal Act, has to do with "...having a population according to the last enumeration taken under section 15 of the Assessment Act that exceeds 10,000, may pass bylaws."
Mr Hayes: Yes.
Mr McLean: I have some questions on that and I'm wondering if I could get a clarification. This figure of 10,000 bothers me somewhat, and I'm wondering if it wouldn't be possible that regulations could be drafted to deal with this issue instead of having it in legislation.
Mr Philip McKinstry: There are a couple of things I want to say there. One is that in legislation there needs to be clear authority for what you're going to do. The legislation itself needs to address which municipalities specifically have this power, so that's why the 10,000 is in the legislation.
In terms of the reason we put in the 10,000, there was some concern in the rural parts of the province that this kind of authority should not be applied to them, and therefore the government decided that a threshold of 10,000 would allow larger, more urban municipalities to use this power, and smaller municipalities may not need it.
Mr McLean: What would happen in a case such as the town of Penetanguishene, with a population of approximately 6,000? They would not be part of this legislation?
Mr McKinstry: That's right. Penetanguishene would not have the authority to pass bylaws to control tree-cutting.
Mr McLean: I think that's where the problem is. A lot of these small municipalities, small towns and hamlets would like some type of legislation that they could pass bylaws. I think rural Ontario wants to be left alone with regard to tree-cutting bylaws, the farmers, but small-town Ontario is looking for some protection. This doesn't address that small-town Ontario population, right?
Mr McKinstry: What it does is simply gives a threshold and says that smaller municipalities don't have this power.
Mr McLean: That's right. They have no power. They won't have any bylaws.
Mr Hayes: They're going to have the power coming through private bills and regulations.
Mr McKinstry: Yes, or the Trees Act.
Mr McLean: If they have power through regulations, then what's the point of putting it in here? Why can't the rural people have power with the regulations, the same as the small town can?
Mr McKinstry: I think any municipality can apply for private legislation. Private legislation could apply to any municipality.
Mr McLean: That's happened a lot in the past. They've come and applied for a private member's bill to be able to do that.
The Chair: Did you want to respond, Mr Hayes?
Mr Hayes: Dealing with this particular issue, I think it's only fair that we let all members know that it was quite a controversial issue.
There are some who wanted to give the authority to all municipalities and then of course there are others who didn't want it that way, and of course there was the concern about rural Ontario. I know that one of the farm organizations had some concerns with it. That's why we went to the 10,000, so it actually would exempt a lot of those municipalities that really didn't want to deal with the issue.
Mr Ron Eddy (Brant-Haldimand): Perhaps we're discussing something that is not before us. However, I'd continue in that vein because I have an important legal question: how a section like this in the Municipal Act fits in with the Trees Act.
If an upper tier has a bylaw passed and approved under the Trees Act, that would govern the local municipalities. This would allow the local municipalities in a county over 10,000 to also pass a bylaw. So then the point comes up about conflict between the two. Does the upper tier, if there is one -- and I know that's optional -- perhaps take precedence over any local bylaw?
I have another point. As you know, when an upper-tier municipality passes a bylaw under the Trees Act, it's a very complicated matter. It even deals with the penalties that can be imposed, such as replanting an area, with or without a fine, or indeed a fine only, and all sorts of things. It's quite a complicated act and procedure. There are provisions for hearings by land owners if they wish to apply to remove a portion of a woodlot for some reason or other, but it does not adversely affect a property owner who wishes to cut trees, under specified sizes, for his or her own use. Of course, that's another thing: There are all sorts of sizes of specific trees listed.
Could I have some comment on that, just to be clear?
Mr Hayes: On the first part of your question, dealing with the conflict, "If there is a conflict between a bylaw passed under subsection (1) and a bylaw passed under the Trees Act, the provision that is the most restrictive of the injuring or destruction of trees prevails." That's subsection (14).
The other question is in subsection (17): "If a person is convicted of an offence under a bylaw passed under subsection (1), the court in which the conviction has been entered, and any court of competent jurisdiction thereafter, may order the person to replant or have replanted such trees in such manner and within such period of time as the court considers appropriate, including any silvicultural treatment necessary to re-establish the trees or have the trees re-established." So that addresses that.
Mr Eddy: Thank you. I think that clears up the points I have, as far as I know.
The Chair: Any further discussion on this side? No? All right. Mr McLean, Mr Eddy and Mr Curling, do we have unanimous consent to deem this in order?
Mr Alvin Curling (Scarborough North): What were we deeming in order?
Mr Hayes: The four amendments.
Mr Curling: To present them?
The Chair: Yes. So there is unanimous consent to bring them forward. Part of the motion is to consider the issue of deeming them in order. Should we put the motion again, Madam Clerk?
Clerk of the Committee (Ms Donna Bryce): If there's unanimous consent to bring them forward, at this point Mr Hayes would read them into the record and then they would give unanimous consent to deem them to be in order.
The Chair: All right. Mr Hayes, would like to read them for the record?
Mr Hayes: Each motion?
The Chair: Yes.
Mr Hayes: We're on page 162 of the government's amendments. I move that the bill be amended by adding the following section:
"37.1 The act is amended by adding the following section:
"Proceeds of fines
"67.1 If an offence has been committed within a municipality under section 31, 41, 52 or 67 or under a bylaw passed under section 34 or 38, and a proceeding in respect of the offence is undertaken by the municipality and a conviction has been entered, the proceeds of any fine in relation to the offence shall be paid to the treasurer of the municipality and section 2 of the Administration of Justice Act and section 4 of the Fines and Forfeitures Act do not apply in respect of the fines."
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This is amendment number 180, the trees.
I move that section 52 of the bill be amended by adding the following section to the Municipal Act:
"Bylaws respecting trees
"223.2(1) The council of a local municipality, having a population according to the last enumeration taken under section 15 of the Assessment Act that exceeds 10,000, may pass bylaws,
"(a) prohibiting or regulating the injuring or destruction of trees or any class of trees specified in the bylaw in any defined area or on any class of land;
"(b) requiring that a permit be obtained for the injuring or destruction of trees specified in the bylaw and prescribing fees for the permit; and
"(c) prescribing circumstances under which a permit may be issued.
"Conditions
"(2) The council may impose such conditions to a permit as in the opinion of the council are reasonable.
"Delegation
"(3) The council may by bylaw delegate the authority to issue permits to an appointed officer, including the authority to impose conditions to permits.
"Conditions
"(4) A delegation made by a council under subsection (3) may be subject to such conditions as the council may by bylaw provide.
"Appeal to the OMB
"(5) An applicant for a permit under a bylaw passed under subsection (1) may appeal to the Municipal Board,
"(a) if the council refuses to issue a permit, within 30 days after the refusal;
"(b) if the council fails to make a decision on an application, within 45 days after the application is received by the clerk; or
"(c) if the applicant objects to a condition in the permit, within 30 days after the issuance of the permit.
"Order
"(6) The Municipal Board may make any decision that the council that received the application for a permit could have made.
"Appointment of officers
"(7) The council may by bylaw designate one or more persons as officers for the purposes of this section and assign to them the responsibility for the enforcement of the bylaw.
"Inspections
"(8) Subsections 223.1(4) to (8) apply as though an officer were an inspector.
"Order
"(9) If an officer is satisfied that a contravention of a bylaw passed under subsection (1) has occurred, the officer may make an order requiring the person to stop the injuring or destruction of trees and the order shall contain particulars of the contravention.
"Appeal
"(10) A person to whom an order under subsection (9) has been directed may appeal the order to the council of the municipality by filing a notice of appeal with the clerk of the municipality within 30 days after the date of the order.
"Hearing
"(11) As soon as practicable after a notice of appeal is filed, council shall hear the appeal and may confirm, alter or revoke the order.
"Decision final
"(12) The decision of council under subsection (11) is final.
"Non-application
"(13) A bylaw passed under this section does not apply to,
"(a) activities or matters undertaken by the provincial or federal government or their agents or Ontario Hydro;
"(b) activities or matters authorized under the Crown Timber Act; or
"(c) activities or matters prescribed by regulation.
"Conflicts
"(14) If there is a conflict between a bylaw passed under subsection (1) and a bylaw passed under the Trees Act, the provision that is the most restrictive of the injuring or destruction of trees prevails.
"Offence
"(15) A bylaw passed under subsection (1) may provide that any person who contravenes the bylaw or an order under subsection (9) is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable,
"(a) on a first conviction, to a fine of not more than $10,000; and
"(b) on any subsequent conviction, to a fine of not more than $20,000.
"Further order
"(16) If a person is convicted of an offence under a bylaw passed under subsection (1), in addition to any other remedy or any penalty provided by law, the court in which the conviction has been entered, and any court of competent jurisdiction thereafter, may make an order prohibiting the continuation or repetition of the offence of any person.
"Same
"(17) If a person is convicted of an offence under a bylaw passed under subsection (1), the court in which the conviction has been entered, and any court of competent jurisdiction thereafter, may order the person to replant or have replanted such trees in such manner and within such period of time as the court considers appropriate, including any silvicultural treatment necessary to re-establish the trees or have the trees re-established.
"Obstruction
"(18) No person shall obstruct an officer who is carrying out an inspection under this section.
"Offence
"(19) A person who contravenes subsection (18) is guilty of an offence.
"Agreement respecting enforcement
"(20) The council of a regional, metropolitan or district municipality and the county of Oxford and a county may enter into an agreement with one or more local municipalities for the designation by the council of one or more officers for the administration of bylaws passed under subsection (1) by the local municipality or municipalities and for charging those municipalities the whole or part of the costs of the officers.
"Regulations
"(21) The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations prescribing activities or matters to which bylaws under this section do not apply."
Now we go to 186.
I move that the bill be amended by adding the following section:
"57.1 Subsections 50(2) and (3) of the Condominium Act are repealed and the following substituted:
"Application of Planning Act
"(2) Subject to subsection (3), sections 51, 51.1 and 51.2 of the Planning Act apply with necessary modifications to a description under this act, and a description shall not be registered unless approved or exempted by the approval authority.
"Application for exemption
"(3) Before making an application under subsection 51(11) of the Planning Act, the owner of a property or someone authorized by the owner in writing may apply to the approval authority to have the description exempted from sections 51 and 51.1, or from any provision of them, and where, in the opinion of the approval authority the exemption is appropriate, it may grant the exemption."
Now we go to page 189.
I move that the bill be amended by adding the following section:
"Lakes and Rivers Improvement Act
"62.1 Subsection 3(1) of the Lakes and Rivers Improvement Act is amended by adding the following clause:
"(c) delegating to a conservation authority or other agency or body the power to grant all or part of an approval required under this act."
The Chair: Is there unanimous consent to deem these motions in order?
Mr Curling: As presented?
The Chair: As read into the record, yes. Okay, there is unanimous consent.
We'll deal with each one of these items as we get to them in order of sequence.
Mr Hayes: You mean I've got to read them again?
The Chair: No. It's not yet 4 o'clock, so what we'll do is read the motions the way we normally would do things and when 4 o'clock comes along there won't be any debate or any amendment, we'll simply vote on the motions.
Mr McLean: Could I have a clarification from the ministry staff? I'm not so sure, but I think we're aware that about 60% of the municipalities have official plans. My reading of what we have done so far -- and I think the question we have asked is that any municipality that already has an official plan approved -- once this 163 is passed, every municipality in the province that has an official plan now, a zoning bylaw, will have to bring it up to date once this is passed. Is that clear?
Mr McKinstry: Yes, there would be an onus on the municipalities with official plans to bring them up to date when they have their five-year review. That's how the legislation is written. It's at the time of their five-year review.
Mr McLean: Then for clarification further, any municipality that hasn't got an official plan would have to have one within five years?
Mr McKinstry: No, there are a limited number of municipalities that are required to have official plans. They are regions, separated cities, cities in the territorial districts in the north and any prescribed counties. Those are the only ones that would be required to have an official plan.
Mr McLean: So any local municipality wouldn't have to have one if they didn't want it.
Mr McKinstry: That's right.
Mr Curling: A question for the ministry staff: Considering that they have to bring it up to date -- I think the question was asked before; I'm not quite sure I'm clear on this -- who will pay for this updating?
Mr McLean: The municipality.
Mr McKinstry: The process of preparing and adopting and updating official plans is an ongoing process among all municipalities. Our experience is that we always have many official plans before us for review; many official plans are being updated, so we see this as an ongoing activity. We will be working with municipalities to help them in any way we can to update them.
Mr Curling: You mean we have to pay for it. There's a cost then.
Mr McKinstry: I can't make any commitments about any potential moneys that might be given to municipalities, but certainly at the staff level we would plan to work with them to the best of our ability.
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Mr Curling: Maybe I can ask the parliamentary assistant to help me on this then. I hear that updating a plan is a continuous process, and of course the ministry staff and all the experts will be assisting those municipalities to bring it up to date. If there is a cost involved, could the parliamentary assistant assure us that this kind of money will not be on the costs of the municipality? Will the government assist them in this process?
Mr Hayes: My understanding is that there is no plan to change the existing structure as far as finances. If we come to situations where a municipality needs the extra funding to do things, I'm sure that --
Mr Curling: That wasn't my question.
Mr Hayes: Well, no. My answer to your question is that I do not have the authority to make commitments as far as saying pay municipalities to do their official plans.
Mr Curling: Who has the authority there? Who would have the authority to assist a municipality, because the laws the province has brought forward have changed the game, and that game --
Mr Hayes: Well, let's not --
Mr Curling: I'm not arguing it. I'm just really more --
Mr Hayes: If I may, Mr Chair, I believe, and I guess I could be corrected on this if I'm wrong, but the government of Ontario does assist municipalities now in service and, somewhat, some funding. I don't see where that is going to change.
Mr Curling: Oh, so you will pay for it then? Thanks.
Mr McLean: Just a quick clarification, Mr Chair: It has been brought to my attention that quite possibly the average update of an official plan would be probably $80,000, which would be borne by the municipality, which is about a $10-million downloading from the provincial government on to the local government. Would I be pretty close on that?
Mr Hayes: That's just your opinion.
The Chair: Thank you, Mr McLean. Mr Hayes, let's begin. Page 138: Would you read that into the record. You have five minutes.
Mr Hayes: I move that section 29 of the bill be amended by adding the following section to the Planning Act:
"Delegation to committee or officer
"51.2(1) If a regional, district, county or city council or the council of the county of Oxford is the approval authority under section 51 in respect of the approval of plans of subdivision, the council may by bylaw delegate all or any part of the authority to approve plans of subdivision to a committee of council or to an appointed officer identified in the bylaw by name or position occupied.
"Delegation to local municipality
"(2) If a regional, county or district council or the council of the county of Oxford is the approval authority under section 51 in respect of the approval of plans of subdivision, the council may, after the prescribed notice is given, by bylaw delegate all or any part of the authority to approve plans of subdivision to a constituent local or area municipality in respect of land situate in the local or area municipality.
"Delegation to planning authority
"(3) If a county council or city council is the approval authority under section 51 in respect of the approval of plans of subdivision, the council may, after the prescribed notice is given, by bylaw delegate all or any part of the authority to approve plans of subdivision to a municipal planning authority in respect of land situate in the municipal planning area.
"Further delegation
"(4) If authority is delegated to a council under subsection (2), the council may in turn by bylaw delegate all or any part of the authority to a committee of council or to an appointed officer identified in the bylaw by name or position occupied.
"Same
"(5) If authority is delegated to a municipal planning authority under subsection (3) or subsection 51(10.1), the municipal planning authority may in turn by bylaw delegate all or any part of the authority to a committee of the municipal planning authority or to an appointed officer identified in the bylaw by name or position occupied.
"Conditions
"(6) A delegation of authority made by a council or municipal planning authority under this section may be subject to such conditions as the council or municipal planning authority by bylaw provides.
"Withdrawal of delegation
"(7) A council or a municipal planning authority may by bylaw withdraw a delegation of authority made by a council or a municipal planning authority under this section and such withdrawal may be either in respect of one or more plans of subdivision specified in the bylaw or any or all plans of subdivision in respect of which a final disposition was not made before the withdrawal."
The Chair: That was 138 in the act?
Mr Hayes: It wasn't in the act; it was pages.
The Chair: What pages in the bill? Does anybody know?
Mr Hayes: Do you want me to explain the bill?
The Chair: Let me just ask you a question.
Mr Hayes: No, this is --
The Chair: It's not in the bill?
Mr Hayes: No, it isn't in the bill now. This is an addition to the bill.
Mr McLean: Can I get a clarification then -- you can cut me off if I'm out of order on that -- with regard to the parkland? Isn't that in this? Section 51.1, where it talks about the subdivision rules "for commercial and industrial purposes, 2% and in all other cases 5% of the land included in the plan shall be conveyed to the local municipality for park or other public recreational purposes," are you referring to that? I don't see you referring to that in here. Is that not part of this?
Mr McKinstry: The motion that we put forward has to do with municipal planning authorities and providing them with the ability to approve subdivisions.
Mr McLean: But is it still going to be 2% for parkland?
Mr McKinstry: Yes. The parkland provisions don't change, by virtue of what the parliamentary assistant has just read. They remain.
Mr McLean: Thank you.
The Chair: Seeing that it's 4 o'clock, we'll simply begin voting on these matters, including this motion that has just been read into the record.
All in favour of the motion?
Interjection.
The Chair: Mr Curling, at 4 o'clock on this day, by standing order 46, "those amendments which have not yet been moved shall be deemed to have been moved and the Chair of the committee shall interrupt the proceedings and shall, without further amendment or debate, put every question necessary to dispose of all remaining sections of the bill and any amendments thereto," and that's what we're doing.
Mr McLean: Where are Elie and Philip and Mackenzie in opposition when they're needed?
The Chair: Okay, I think we're ready for the vote on this motion. All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 138a, on section 29, as amended: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 139: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 139a: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 139b: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 140: All in favour? Opposed? That is defeated.
Page 141 --
Mr Curling: Mr Chair, could I have a recorded vote for this one?
The Chair: We're not dealing with any amendments or any other point. We're simply --
Mr Curling: A recorded vote -- we're not going to deal with that?
The Chair: I'm sorry. Is that what you're asking?
Mr Curling: Yes.
The Chair: We'll leave to the very end matters that require a vote.
Mr Curling: But they're all requiring a vote here. That's what we're doing.
The Chair: We will make a point of the ones that need a recorded vote and we'll get to them at the end. Pat?
Mr Hayes: Yes.
The Chair: Just as a point of reminder, if you want a recorded vote, please ask for it before we introduce it, and we'll defer them to the end and then we'll vote on those at the end.
Page 141 --
Mr McLean: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Okay. All in favour? Oh, no, we'll deal with that at the end. Very well.
Page 141a: All in favour of the motion? Opposed? That carries.
Page 142: All in favour?
Mr Curling: Wait a second now. Let me know where we are. Slow down a bit.
The Chair: Page 142: All in favour?
Mr McLean: Recorded vote.
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Mr Wiseman: Are you going to ask for a recorded vote on everything?
Mr McLean: I may.
The Chair: Page 143: All in favour of the motion? Opposed? That's defeated.
Page 144: This amendment is identical to the previous Liberal amendment, 143, so we'll move on.
Page 145: All in favour?
Mr McLean: On a point of privilege, Mr Chair: You said 144. We haven't voted on that yet.
The Chair: It is identical, so it's out of order.
Page 145: All in favour of the motion? Opposed? That carries.
Page 146: All in favour? Opposed?
Mr Curling: On a point of order, Mr Chair: Can we just get right on in that dictatorial way? Just say, "Let's move all of them and pass them," because you're going to wear it out.
The Chair: Thank you, Mr Curling.
Page 147: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 148: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 149: All in favour? Opposed? That is defeated.
Page 150: The amendment is identical to the previous Liberal amendment so it's out of order.
Page 151: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 152: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 153: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 154: All in favour?
Mr McLean: A recorded vote on that one, Mr Chair.
The Chair: Page 155: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 156: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
This is page 157. All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Mr Curling: Could I have a recorded vote on that?
Clerk of the Committee: It's a recorded vote, so we'll leave it till later.
The Chair: Page 157(i): All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 157(ii) --
Mr McLean: A recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 157(iii): All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Page 157(iv): All in favour? Opposed? Carries.
Page 157b --
Mr McLean: A recorded vote on that one.
The Chair: A recorded vote, okay.
Page 157c: All in favour of the motion?
Mr McLean: A recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 157d --
Interjection.
The Chair: Okay, there's no change to that section. Shall section 33 of the bill carry? All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Mr Gilles Bisson (Cochrane South): How can you carry something you haven't voted on?
The Chair: There's no change. There's no motion to that.
Clerk of the Committee: Just to clarify, we're on section 33. The recorded votes were requested to sections prior to section 33.
The Chair: The previous one.
Mr McLean: Could I have a clarification on that, Mr Chair? On this 157d, it tells me that the government recommends voting against section 33 of the bill. You just --
Mr Curling: They all voted for it.
Mr McLean: -- had a motion and they all voted for it.
Mr Hayes: No.
The Chair: On 157d?
Mr Hayes: As amended.
Mr McLean: You voted in favour of it.
Mr Curling: "The government recommends voting against section 33 of the bill," and you all voted for it.
Mr Hayes: No, we voted that down and we voted for that section.
Mr McLean: You voted for section 33?
Mr Hayes: As amended, yes.
Mr McLean: But you recommended that you vote against it.
Interjections.
Mr Hayes: Yes, you're right, we did, because you guys didn't like it.
Mr Curling: "Section 33 of the bill: The government recommends voting against it." Are you the government or not? Are you the government?
Interjections.
The Chair: Okay, page 158.
Mr Curling: What about 157d? You're jumping to 158 now?
The Chair: Donna, do you want to chat about that?
Clerk of the Committee: The Chair asked, "Shall section 33 carry?" and it carried by a majority of the committee.
Mr McLean: I was asking the parliamentary assistant for clarification. It carried and it recommends the government vote against it. So what does that say, that the government voted against what the recommendation was?
Mr Hayes: It just shows that we listen and we can change.
Interjection: We have a problem with that.
Mr Hayes: Yes, you have a problem with it.
Mr Curling: I just need an explanation from the Chair. It says here, "The government recommends voting against section 33." We just went through section 33 a while ago and you voted for it, and then this bill says the government recommends now that you vote against it, and you did not.
Interjections.
The Chair: I'm not sure we can discuss the matter. That's quite a problem.
Mr Hayes: I'm not going to discuss the bill; I'm going to try to discuss what happened.
The Chair: I know. I'm not sure we can do that either. We can't. It's been read.
Okay, page 158: All in favour of the motion?
Mr Hayes: Which one?
The Chair: Page 158; it's a government motion. All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Shall section 34 carry, as amended? That carries.
Page 159; it's a government motion: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Shall section 35 carry, as amended? It carries.
Page 160, government motion: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Shall section 36 carry, as amended? That carries.
Page 161; it's a government motion.
Mr McLean: A recorded vote on that.
The Chair: Page 162, government motion: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
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Page 163, a PC motion: All in favour?
Mr McLean: Recorded vote.
The Chair: It's out of order.
Mr Chris Stockwell (Etobicoke West): Why is it out of order?
The Chair: We dealt with page 162, which is very much similar to the motion that you put on 163, so that would be out of order.
Mr Stockwell: What do you mean "similar"?
Mr Hayes: It's improved.
The Chair: Just as a quick word, it's repetitive; therefore, I'm going to rule that out of order.
Page 164, government motion: All in favour? Opposed?
Mr Stockwell: Page 164? We've got a problem with it.
The Chair: Mr Stockwell, just as a reminder, there's no debate on these things. We just vote on them.
Interjection: We already voted on 164.
The Chair: We voted on 163. Just going back to that, all in favour of --
Mr McLean: A recorded vote.
Interjection.
The Chair: I want those other members, those of you, to settle down. We're going to go through this, okay?
Shall section 38 carry?
Mr Stockwell: Hold it. Where are you?
Mr Curling: Why don't --
The Chair: Opposed?
Mr Stockwell: Where are you?
The Chair: Shall section 39 carry? Opposed? Okay.
Shall section 40 carry? Carried.
Page 164, government motion: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Mr McLean: I asked for a recorded vote on that some time ago.
Mr Hayes: He did.
The Chair: Did you? Do we have a note of that? All right. Mr McLean asked for a recorded vote on that, page 164.
Page 165; it's a Liberal motion.
Mr Curling: I want a recorded vote on this one.
The Chair: Page 165 has been deferred to later for a recorded vote; 166 is a similar motion, identical to the previous one, so I will be ruling that out of order when we get to it.
Mr Stockwell: Regardless of what happens with 165?
The Chair: We're going to have to deal with the other, one way or the other. If it's defeated or passed, 166 will have the similar fate.
Page 167: All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on to section 43 now. Shall section 43 carry?
Mr Stockwell: No, recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 169.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr McLean: Mr Chair, could I have a clarification? Page 169, we haven't dealt with that yet. You said section 43 was carried. How can you carry section 43 when you haven't done --
The Chair: Section 43.1 is a new section.
Mr McLean: You said, "Shall section 43 carry?"
Clerk of the Committee: Section 43.1 is a new section and it comes after section 43.
Mr Curling: But one second though, the last carried section you did was 39, I think. What else did you do? Did we carry 40? No, I didn't hear that.
Clerk of the Committee: Recorded votes were requested on those sections; therefore, in accordance with the time allocation motion, all those questions will be deferred until the very end and then we'll go through them one by one.
Mr Curling: So, if there's a recorded vote that is called on a section, you can't call the section carried then?
Clerk of the Committee: No, because you haven't voted on the amendment yet.
The Chair: Okay, moving on --
Mr Curling: Could I ask a --
Mr Bisson: We're in the middle of a vote.
Mr Stockwell: This isn't --
Mr Curling: Listen --
Mr Stockwell: Let's get it straight.
Interjections.
The Chair: Mr Curling, go ahead.
Mr Curling: Try and put me straight because I really need to be put straight on this. In some of those sections that we moved, we asked for recorded votes, and then you moved for those sections to be passed. Now you're telling me that if any recorded vote is requested, you can't move for those sections to be passed. First I'm going to ask you: If we ask for a recorded vote, can we move that section to be passed?
The Chair: All right. Where you have asked for a recorded vote, we have deferred that item, so we don't ask for sections --
Mr Curling: But we did so in some of those sections.
The Chair: I am not aware that we have done that on a matter where you've asked for a recorded vote.
Mr Curling: Okay. All right.
The Chair: We're on section 44.
Mr McLean: Can I have a clarification on section 37? Was it carried?
The Chair: No, you have a recorded vote on that.
Mr McLean: That's right. Okay.
The Chair: We're on section 44. All in favour of section 44?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 45: All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Mr Stockwell, can I precede you? Is it your intention to have a recorded vote on all of these, in which case we can just do that?
Mr Stockwell: I'm not sure. It's dangerous to precede me.
The Chair: Page 171: All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 172.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 173.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on section 48. All in favour of section 48?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Curling: This is what I am saying. I just want to -- there's no 48 to move. Okay.
The Chair: We're on section 49 now.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Interjection: What page are you on?
The Chair: Page 174.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 175.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 176.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 177.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 178.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Okay, 178: This is out of order. It's outside the scope of the bill, and 179 is identical to the previous one, so that too is out of order. Page 180.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Curling: May I ask a question here, though? This is a new one that's been put in. There's no debate on this. You just slide this in earlier on and no debate.
The Chair: There's no debate. Page 181.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 182: out of order. Page 184.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 185.
Mr Bisson: Recorded vote.
Interjection: Gilles, let them do their silly stuff. You don't have to.
Mr Stockwell: Unparliamentary language.
The Chair: We're on section 54 now.
Mr Stockwell: Was that a recorded vote on 185, Mr Chair?
The Chair: Yes. We're on section 54. All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 55.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 56.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 57.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote. You're not going to use the replacement government motion?
Interjections.
Ms Christel Haeck (St Catharines-Brock): Mr Chair, may I make a motion that we have recorded votes on all of them so that we can abbreviate this whole process, so we can just do them right now?
The Chair: I'm not sure we can do that. It's out of order.
Mr Stockwell: You need unanimous consent.
The Chair: We just have to go through this.
Mr Stockwell: Go ahead and seek unanimous consent. It's out of order.
The Chair: Page 186. Is there unanimous consent for that, by the way?
Mr Stockwell: No.
The Chair: Page 186.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on section 58 now.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote. If I'm out of turn, just let me know.
The Chair: For sure. Page 187.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: On section 60 now.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
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The Chair: Page 188.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 188a.
Interjections.
The Chair: We're on section 62. Shall section 62 carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Too late.
Mr Curling: Point of order, Mr Chairman: Can you pass a motion to pass a page or is it on the section you're doing? You're saying: "Page 188 passed."
Mr Bisson: How long have you been here, Alvin?
Mr Curling: Are you the Chair?
The Chair: Mr Curling, please. I'm willing to entertain what you have you say. It's probably out of order, but go ahead.
Mr Curling: You mean before I speak it's probably out of order?
Mr Bisson: Yes, that's right.
Mr Curling: Mr Chair, please --
The Chair: Mr Bisson.
Mr Curling: I know you put in 188. Is it in order to just say "188," or is it --
Clerk of the Committee: Yes. It's just an easy way of identifying it.
Mr Curling: It can be done, okay. That's all I'm asking.
The Chair: Page 189.
Mr Stockwell: Pardon me. So you're going to call the page numbers, not the sections?
The Chair: That's right.
Mr Stockwell: It would be easier to call the sections.
The Chair: I'm going to call the page number. Follow the page number, please.
Mr Stockwell: Is that in order, to go clause by clause and call page numbers?
The Chair: I'm going to go page by page.
Mr Stockwell: I ask the clerk, is that in order? We're going clause by clause and we don't call sections, we call page numbers?
The Chair: I was ruling that it's all right for us to just simply name the page.
Clerk of the Committee: Unless you're requesting otherwise, it is in order for the Chair to read out the page number.
Mr Stockwell: Yes, I'm requesting otherwise.
Clerk of the Committee: Fine.
The Chair: Shall section 62.1 of the bill carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: We already voted. You're too late on that one.
Mr Stockwell: It's called a subsection as well, Mr Chair.
The Chair: Shall section 63 carry? That carries.
Shall section 64 carry?
Mr Stockwell: No, a recorded vote.
The Chair: Shall section 65 carry? Carried.
Shall section 66 carry?
Interjections: Carried.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Too late.
The Chair: Section 67 of the bill: We're on page 189 and this is an amendment which would amend clause 37(e) of the Ontario Municipal Board Act. Shall that carry? Carried.
We're on section 67, as amended. Shall that carry? Carried.
We're on section 68. Shall that carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: He wasn't in his seat.
The Chair: That doesn't matter.
Page 190, an amendment to subsection 69(1) of the bill, clause 77(1)(e) of the Ontario Municipal Board Act: Shall that carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on section 70 now. Shall section 70 carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Shall sections 71 to 84 carry?
Mr Stockwell: Can you call them individually, Mr Chair, please? This is clause-by-clause actually.
The Chair: On section 71, shall it carry?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 72.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 73.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 74.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 75.
Mr McLean: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Oh, there's another member over there.
The Chair: Section 76.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 77.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 78.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 79.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 80.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 81.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 82.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 83.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 84.
Mr Hayes: Give Al a turn.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Bisson: Are you going to be here for all those votes, Chris?
Mr Stockwell: Maybe, but I know you will be.
The Chair: We're on the amendment, page 192, to subsection 85(1) of the bill.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 86.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 87.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 88.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 193.
Mr Stockwell: What's 193?
The Chair: Schedule A to the bill, subsection 1(1) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 194, schedule A to the bill, subsection 1(1) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 195, schedule A to the bill, subsection 1(2) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 2.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 3.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 196, schedule A to the bill, subsection 4(3) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 197, schedule A to the bill, clause 4(4)(c) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 5: All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 197a, schedule A to the bill, subsection 6(4) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 7: All in favour of section 7?
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: Section 8: All in favour of section 8?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 9.
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: All in favour of section 10?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Too late.
The Chair: It's too late. All in favour of section 11?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: All in favour of section 12?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: All in favour of section 13?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: All in favour of section 14?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Just as a point, Mr Stockwell, when I call, "All in favour?" and they all agree and you then say "Recorded vote," that's a problem. If you want a recorded vote, say it in advance.
Mr Stockwell: In advance? Can you go a little slower then so you give me some time to say it?
The Chair: I'm going to go at the pace that I have.
Mr Stockwell: Oh, I see, so you're not going to go any slower.
The Chair: That's right.
Mr Curling: Which section are you going to next now?
The Chair: We are on page 198 now.
Mr Curling: I think a recorded vote for that one. Will you just tell us where you are first before you call the vote?
The Chair: Okay. A recorded vote on that.
Section 16.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote. Is that soon enough?
Interjection: Yes.
Mr Stockwell: Good.
The Chair: Page 198a, schedule A to the bill, section 16.1 of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 17: All in --
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote. Sorry, I was a little slow.
The Chair: Page 199.
Mr Hayes: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Hold it.
Mr Hayes: Carried.
The Chair: Schedule A to the bill, clause 18(2)(b) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 200, schedule A to the bill, section 19 of the Ontario Planning and Development Act. All in favour?
Mr Hayes: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
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The Chair: Section 20.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 200a, schedule A to the bill, subsection 21(3) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Hayes: Passed.
The Chair: Page 200b, schedule A to the bill, subsection 21(4) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on section 22 now.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote. If you had done this right in the first place, we wouldn't be doing this like this.
The Chair: We're on section 1 of schedule B.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 201, schedule B to the bill, subsection 2(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. All in favour of the bill?
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: Page 202, schedule B to the bill, subsection 2(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Pardon me, Mr Chair, you're at 202, did you say? I have a 201a. I think they mismarked it 210a, but it's 201a, I believe.
The Chair: I don't have a 201a; I have a 201.
Mr Stockwell: I have a 201.
The Chair: And that we passed.
Mr Stockwell: Or is it 210a? I'm sorry.
Mr Hayes: No, we defeated it.
Mr Stockwell: Okay, I'll keep that in mind.
Mr Hayes: Did you pass it?
Mr Bisson: Yes, we passed it.
Mr Stockwell: I know a Liberal motion just passed, but I'll keep going.
Mr Curling: Because you were ramming the things down, obviously there will be no recorded vote.
Mr Stockwell: We didn't get a recorded vote on 201, so it carries, I know. Let's move on; let's get going. It's passed. Let's move on.
Mr Bisson: What does that say? It says "Liberal."
Mr Stockwell: There are seven or eight or 10 of you over there. Surely you can match one of us over here.
Mr Wiseman: Page 201 didn't carry.
Mr Bisson: Point of order, Mr Chair, on the vote.
The Chair: Madam Clerk.
Mr Bisson: Point of order, Mr Chair, on the vote.
The Chair: Page 201, schedule B.
Interjections.
The Chair: All right. Mr Stockwell, calm down, please.
Mr Bisson: Point of order, Mr Chair, on the vote: You called for schedule B to the bill, subsection 2(1). I voted opposed to this motion. So did my colleagues. I would like to know what the ruling of the Chair is.
Mr Stockwell: Could I speak to that point of order, Mr Chair?
The Chair: He said he opposed it; she said she opposed it.
Interjection: There are five members who voted against it.
The Chair: You can't speak to it.
Mr Stockwell: Can I ask a question? I know they get a chance to debate, but --
The Chair: Mr Bisson, hold on, please.
Mr Wiseman: He asked for a recorded vote.
The Chair: You made the point. I'm asking the clerk whether she saw whether people were voting in favour or not of this motion. What the clerk is saying is that she --
Interjection: She said, "Opposed."
Mr Hayes: Let him finish.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, I'd like to comment on it.
The Chair: Hold on.
Clerk of the Committee: The chair asked, "Shall it carry?" and I heard, "Carried."
Mr Stockwell: Yes, that's what I heard too.
The Chair: If that's what we heard, then that's what we heard.
Mr Stockwell: So let's move on.
Mr Curling: Let's move on.
Mr Stockwell: Good ruling.
Mr Bisson: I would like to clarify for the record that myself, and I know at least one other of my colleagues, voted opposed to this particular motion. The parliamentary assistant voted in favour. That's what you heard in favour; you didn't hear the opposed.
Mr Hayes: That's what happened. I wasn't --
Mr Stockwell: For the record --
Interjections.
Mr Bisson: Mr Chair, I last counted that there were five members on the opposition side benches, a total of four with the parliamentary assistant with the opposition --
The Chair: Is there unanimous consent to vote on that motion again? No.
Interjections.
Mr Stockwell: I know that it's a point of order and we all get an opportunity -- quickly, Mr Chair, what I heard very clearly was you calling the motion, I heard yeas and a couple of nays, just a couple, and I heard you yell very clearly, "Carried," and I moved on. I did not call for a recorded vote on that.
The Chair: Thank you, Mr Stockwell. We're now on page 202.
Mr Curling: So page 201 is carried.
Mr Bisson: The Liberal motion has been carried.
The Chair: Page 202.
Mr Wiseman: Carried.
Interjection: That's the first one of the day.
The Chair: Does that motion carry?
Interjections: Carried.
The Chair: Okay, that carries.
Page 203.
Mr Curling: Wait a minute again. Mr Chair, you got into trouble the same way by ramming it. We want you to call the section, because you're going back to 202 again and then when you get it carried your colleagues are saying one thing or the other. Let's go slower.
The Chair: Page 203, schedule B, to the balance of subsection 2(2.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 204, schedule B to the bill.
Clerk of the Committee: You're skipping one.
The Chair: Did I miss one? We're on section 3, okay. All in favour of section 3? We're on section 3 of schedule B. All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Mr Curling: What page are you on?
The Chair: We're on page 204. It's government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 205: It's a Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 206, government motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 4(1)(d) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 207, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 4(1)(d) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act: All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, is that in order? Is this motion in order? I just want to get it clarified.
The Chair: It is slightly different. It's in order, yes.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Bisson: It was defeated, Mr Chair.
Mr Hayes: It was already voted on.
The Chair: Which one?
Interjections.
The Chair: No, I'm sorry. Page 206, they wanted a recorded vote. Now we're on 207. It's a different motion --
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: -- and they've asked for a recorded vote.
Mr Bisson: We've already voted on it. This will be the second time.
Mr Stockwell: Only because I want to know if it's in order. Sorry.
The Chair: He asked for a recorded vote on that.
Mr Stockwell: I appreciate your protection, Mr Chair.
The Chair: Page 208, Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 4(1.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Bisson: Did he say "Recorded vote" again?
The Chair: Yes, he did, it's a recorded vote.
Page 209, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(2) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 210, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(2) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote.
The Chair: All in favour? Opposed? I'm sorry, Mr Curling, did I hear you asking for a recorded vote?
Mr Curling: Yes. I said, "Recorded vote."
The Chair: Page 210a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 5(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 211.
Interjection: Recorded vote.
Mr Stockwell: What are we voting on?
The Chair: Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 5(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. It's a recorded vote.
Page 212, Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 5(3).
Mr Stockwell: Of what?
The Chair: Of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote on that one.
The Chair: It's a recorded vote. Section 5 -- oh, it's a recorded vote on that, all right.
Page 213, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 6(4) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Mr Curling: I'll need a recorded vote on the one coming up next.
The Chair: Okay. This motion, 214, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, is similar to the previous one, so I'll rule that out of order.
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Mr Stockwell: Hold it. You're ruling 214 out of order because of 213?
The Chair: Mr Stockwell, you raised the same question earlier on, on the same point. Page 213 is similar to 214; 214 follows and that would be out of order, when we deal with that. We're dealing with that now.
Mr Curling: Couldn't we put the amendments in first and allow these amendments --
The Chair: Page 215, government motion.
Mr Curling: Mr Chairman, one second. I just want a clarification. If these both are the same subsection 6(4), 213 and 214, wouldn't the Liberal amendment come in first and when that is defeated then the government one would come in?
Mr Stockwell: Yes, amendments always go before motions.
The Chair: What we have on 213 is a very similar motion that follows on 214, which is yours.
Mr Curling: You are defeating my stuff here, but you're approving yours before defeating it.
Mr Stockwell: Yes, he has to move the amendment first, Mr Chair.
The Chair: All right. We'll defer that as well along with page 213.
Page 215, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 7(2) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 216, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 7(4) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 217, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, subsections 7(5) and (6) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. All in favour?
Mr Curling: A recorded vote on that.
The Chair: It's opposed, but there's a recorded vote.
Page 218, schedule B to the bill, subsection 8(2.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. Mr Curling asked for a recorded vote.
On 218a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 8(8)(a) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 219 is a Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 8(8)(b) --
Interjection.
Mr Bisson: You're supposed to give him a chance to read --
The Chair: Yes, Mr Curling, can I ask you -- Mr Bisson. Mr Curling, I'm not reading fast. Just wait until I'm done and then ask for a recorded vote.
Mr Curling: Mr Chair, whenever they say "Carried," you say that's too late. You're playing games on us now.
The Chair: Mr Curling, just relax please. Schedule B to the bill, clause 8(8)(b) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: I think that we would ask for a recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 220, Liberal motions.
Mr Bisson: Hold it. On 219 you haven't called for the vote.
The Chair: I think Mr Curling asked for a recorded vote.
Page 220, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsections 8(10), (11) and (12) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act. All in favour?
Mr Curling: I want a recorded vote on that one.
Mr Bisson: That's the way we do it; there we go.
The Chair: Page 221, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 8(14) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote on that one too.
The Chair: Page 222, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 9(1.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: I would like a recorded vote on this one.
The Chair: Page 222a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 9(1.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
Interjection.
Mr Stockwell: Thank you. I'm working on it.
The Chair: Page 223, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 9(2) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: A recorded vote on that one.
The Chair: Page 223a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 10(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 11: All in favour of section 11?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 12?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 13?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Section 14?
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 224, a Liberal motion.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Schedule B of the bill, subsections 15(3) and (4) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote.
The Chair: We'll defer motion 225 along with 224.
Mr Stockwell: Excuse me, Mr Chair. I missed that. We're deferring 225 and what?
The Chair: Along with 224.
Mr Stockwell: We just called for a recorded vote on 224.
Mr Curling: Why are we deferring it?
The Chair: They're identical.
Mr Stockwell: Sorry, I don't mean to slow you down, but we called for a recorded vote just a second ago on 224. Are we then to assume you're deferring 225 and we can move it, or are you ruling it out of order?
The Chair: Deferring it is what we're doing. We're deferring that as well.
Mr Stockwell: What's that, sir? We're deferring 224 and 225?
The Chair: We're going to have a recorded vote on 224. Page 225 is similar. When we get to vote on the other matter, then we'll deal with page 225. When 224 fails or succeeds, 225 will be out of order.
Mr Stockwell: Oh, I see. So you're saying it's going to be out of order regardless.
The Chair: Regardless.
Page 226, a government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsections 15(5) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: On section 16.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 226a, schedule B to the bill, section 17 of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 227, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 18(1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: I'll have a recorded vote there.
The Chair: Page 228, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 18(1.1) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 229, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, section 19 of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Curling: I request a recorded vote.
The Chair: We're on section 20.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: On section 21.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Page 230, a government motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 22(e) of the Local Government Disclosure of Interest Act.
Mr Stockwell: This is on section 22?
The Chair: Section 22, that's right.
Mr Stockwell: Is that at the end, the short title?
The Chair: Whatever I read to you, Mr Stockwell.
Clerk of the Committee: No, it's not.
Mr Stockwell: No? Recorded vote then.
The Chair: On section 23: All in favour of section 23?
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: On section 24.
Mr Stockwell: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Okay.
Now we're going to go through all the sections that were previously stood down.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, is it in order to take a 20-minute recess at this time?
The Chair: We're going to go through it and then you can ask for a 20-minute recess.
Mr Stockwell: So we have to go through all the votes?
Mr Curling: That's the ruling by the clerk?
The Chair: Yes. We're going through all the sections previously stood down.
We're on section 1 of the bill. All in favour?
Interjections: Agreed.
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Mr Curling: One second. I have page 18 here. Is that where we are, the section 1 you're talking about? The schedules have been stood down. We were going in sequence, and all of a sudden there were some behind, that schedule's stood down and 18 is the next one.
Clerk of the Committee: We're on page 2 of the bill. Now that we've gone through the entire bill, we're going to those sections which we stood down during regular clause-by-clause.
The Chair: I explained that. What he wanted to know was the page number of section 1.
Mr Curling: What I saw is in the package you gave me. The next sequence after 230, I saw 18.
The Chair: This is why I said we're going to go through all the sections previously stood down. That's what I said. We're on section 1. We passed that. We're now moving on. We're now moving on to section 2 of the bill.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, I have a question. It says in our notice of closure from the government that we are allowed to call for, pursuant to the act, a 20-minute recess. I'm looking for clarification from you. It says it right in the closure motion.
The Chair: I said we will have a recess at the very end, once we've dealt with all the amendments.
Mr Stockwell: But I'm saying to you that I want to call my 20-minute recess now.
The Chair: And I'm ruling that we'll have that 20 minutes as soon as we've done this.
Mr Stockwell: But I'm perfectly within my rights and it's in order to call for it.
The Chair: The clerk is passing me something to read to you: "Any divisions required shall be deferred until all remaining questions have been put and taken in succession with one 20-minute waiting period allowed pursuant to standing order 128(a)." It's "until all remaining questions have been put," so we're putting all these --
Mr Stockwell: Right, with one 20-minute waiting period between that.
The Chair: We're putting all the questions on all the motions. After that, we'll have a 20-minute recess.
We're on section 2 of the bill.
Ms Haeck: I have a question. I've raised my hand twice now. I would like to know what is happening with section 1.
The Chair: We passed it.
Ms Haeck: Thank you. I was just curious. I didn't hear anything.
The Chair: We're on section 2 of the bill. All in favour?
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: It carries.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, I don't want to be splitting hairs, but when you call for a vote, you're supposed to say, "All those in favour?" and you're supposed to say, "All those opposed?"
The Chair: Thank you, Mr Stockwell. That's what I've done. Moving on --
Mr Stockwell: No, you just said, "All those in favour?"
The Chair: You're out of order now, Mr Stockwell.
Mr Stockwell: Can you call "Opposed?" Thank you.
Mr Curling: Mr Chair, I really want to follow the procedure here. As I said, the package that was given to me --
Mr Eddy: I can share mine with him.
The Chair: Mr Curling, we're going to move through this. Do you have a question about where we are?
Mr Curling: No, I have --
The Chair: That's all we're going to be dealing with. We're just going to --
Mr Curling: Mr Chairman, if you'll listen to what I want --
The Chair: No, Mr Curling, this is the motion. We've got to go through these one by one and we vote on them. That's what we do here, okay? If you want to know what page we're on, I'll tell you. If not, we're just going to move on.
Mr Curling: What is my question, Mr Chair?
The Chair: Mr Curling, let me repeat this.
Mr Curling: No. I'm asking one more question to the Chair.
The Chair: No. I tell you, as the Chair, that we're going to be dealing with the motions and we vote on them, yea or nay, and that's all we're supposed to be doing.
Mr Curling: No, no. You see, Mr Chairman --
The Chair: You're out of order, Mr Curling. We're on page 18.
Mr Curling: On a point of order: How can I be out of order when I'm making a point? The point I'm trying to make to you is that there is a package in front of me, and I'm trying to follow the procedures. You gave me this package here, and you reached page 230 and then said we're going to go back. In the back of this thing I have what was stood down. The next one that was stood down, it says, was page 18, 19, and it goes through like that. You say here, "On section 1," and I'm trying to find out what part of section 1 I am.
Clerk of the Committee: Those numbers you have at the end of your package are amendments, and those amendments start at section 7. Section 1 and section 2 of the bill were stood down. There were no amendments to those sections, however, so that's why you don't have anything.
Mr Curling: That's all. I was just trying to find out where he was.
Mr McLean: Can I have a clarification from the Chair? The House has adjourned, and the House leader asked for consent to let the committee sit until 6 o'clock. Can we go on until 7 or 8?
The Chair: Let me read what this says: "That the committee be authorized to continue to meet beyond its normal adjournment if necessary until consideration of clause-by-clause has been completed."
Mr McLean: So we can go until 7 or 8 if necessary.
The Chair: We're on page 18 now, a Liberal motion, section 7 of the bill, subsection 4(6) of the Planning Act.
Mr Curling: We need a recorded vote on that.
The Chair: Mr Curling's asked for a recorded vote.
Page 19.
Ms Haeck: Mr Chair, we've already dealt with this in some sequence earlier. Could we not have the recorded vote now, if I may be so bold to suggest, since numerically, 18 precedes the package we have just dealt with. Motion 18 definitely comes well in advance of the 130s, the 160s, where we've had recorded votes in, what shall I say, an hour ago.
The Chair: The point is that when there's a recorded vote being asked for, whatever sequence it is, we're simply deferring them.
Ms Haeck: I'm prepared to have the recorded vote. I suggest we have it now, since we've actually already dealt with the postponement earlier. This has already been dealt with probably three weeks ago.
The Chair: Ms Bryce, do you want to comment?
Clerk of the Committee: All recorded votes are deferred to the end of clause-by-clause.
The Chair: Page 19, a PC motion, section 7 of the bill, subsection 4(6) of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That's defeated.
Page 32a, a government motion, section 10 of the bill, subsection 17(2) of the Planning Act: All in favour of the motion? Opposed? That carries.
Page 34a, a government motion to section 10 of the bill, subsection 17(3) of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
A government motion to section 10 of the bill, subsection 17(9) of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Section 48, a PC motion to section 10 of the bill, subsection 17(22.1) of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That is defeated.
Page 54, a government motion to section 10 of the bill, clause 17(29)(b) of the Planning Act: All in favour? All opposed? That carries.
Section 66, a government motion to section 10 of the bill, section 17.1 of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That carries.
Section 67 is a Liberal motion to section 10 of the bill, section 17.1 of the Planning Act.
Mr Curling: A recorded vote on this, please.
The Chair: Page 68 is a PC motion to section 10 of the bill, section 17.1 of the Planning Act. All in favour? Opposed? That is defeated.
At page 93 is a Liberal motion to section 25. A question to you, Mr Curling: You have submitted page 93, so we've got two motions. One of your motions is a replacement of the other. Do you want to withdraw the first in order to move --
Mr Curling: Let's do the clause-by-clause first.
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The Chair: Mr Curling, I'm not sure whether we could do that procedurally. Can we do that?
Clerk of the Committee: Yes, that's fine.
The Chair: We were thinking that Mr Curling could withdraw it even though Mr Eddy had moved it.
Mr Curling: I can't withdraw it, is that it?
The Chair: Let me just ask it differently. Is there unanimous consent to allow Mr Curling to withdraw this motion?
Interjection: No.
The Chair: All right. So Liberal motion, page 93, section 25 of the bill, subsection 45(14) of the Planning Act: All in favour? Opposed? That is defeated.
Page 93 is a replacement Liberal motion, section 25 of the bill. It's a new one.
Mr Stockwell: But that's out of order now, isn't it?
The Chair: No, it's a different motion. Section 25 of the bill, subsection 45(12.1) of the Planning Act.
Mr Curling: Recorded vote.
The Chair: Recorded vote.
Mr Stockwell, did you want your 20-minute recess?
Mr Stockwell: Not right now.
Mr McLean: On a point of clarification, Mr Chair: Are we finished with paragraph 17(22)1?
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, what are we doing?
The Chair: Mr McLean has asked a question. Just hold on. When we get there, we'll know the answer.
Mr Stockwell: I thought it was something else.
Mr McLean: When we were dealing with this in clause-by-clause, I had a resolution and it was put on hold and it has never been dealt with: paragraph 17(22)1.
The Chair: Mr McLean, the clerk is going to come and check things out.
Mr Stockwell: Have we resolved the Liberal thing yet? I want to know what's going on with the Liberal motion. There seems to be some confusion.
The Chair: We're not dealing with that right now, Mr Stockwell.
Mr Stockwell: We were.
The Chair: We're just clarifying something. Okay, Mr McLean?
Now we're going to go back to the motions where people have asked for a recorded vote. Page 141, on a recorded vote.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, what happened to 93?
The Chair: What I'm going to refer you to is the page we're dealing with, Mr Stockwell. We're on page 141, a PC motion.
Mr Stockwell: What happened to 93? That's what I want to know.
Clerk of the Committee: Is that page number 93?
Mr Stockwell: Yes.
Clerk of the Committee: The first one lost and the second one was deferred to the end for a recorded vote.
The Chair: We're going back to those matters where people have asked for recorded votes, so we're on page 141 now.
Mr Curling: On those pages, like page 93 and page 18, are you going to put them in sequence now and just take them and record which is quicker?
The Chair: We're going to go in the order that we are in the book and we'll deal with them as we get there.
Mr Curling: So when you're finished, then you go back again to page 18 and what have you.
Clerk of the Committee: In accordance with the time allocation motion, all those amendments and sections on which recorded votes were requested have been deferred to the end. We've gone through the bill; now we're going to go back to all the recorded votes in sections that have been requested by members.
Mr Curling: And you'll take this one although it is earlier on in the section. I just wonder if it's easier.
Clerk of the Committee: Yes, we're just going back to the beginning.
Mr Curling: Okay, all right.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, can I take my 20-minute recess now?
The Chair: A 20-minute recess; reconvene at 5:30.
Mr Bisson: Mr Chair, we're in the process of voting. It is out of order to call a recess in the middle of a vote. You have to do it at the beginning of the vote.
The Chair: I think it's in order at the moment, Mr Bisson.
The committee recessed from 1707 to 1727.
The Chair: Okay, the 20 minutes are up.
We are on page 141, PC motion, section 30 of the bill. All in favour? Opposed? The motion is defeated.
Clerk of the Committee: They asked for a recorded vote.
The Chair: This is a recorded vote, exactly. On the recorded vote, then.
Clerk of the Committee: All opposed? Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White, Mr Hayes.
The Chair: The motion is defeated.
Page 141a was carried.
Page 142, section 30 of the bill; it's a government motion. All those in favour, on a recorded vote?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White.
The Chair: Carried.
Page 143, Liberal motion. That lost.
Interjections.
Mr Hayes: Where are you?
The Chair: Page 154, government motion, section 30 of the bill. All in favour? Same vote. That carries.
We're on page 157, government motion. We are on section 30, as amended. All in favour? A recorded vote? Same vote? That carries.
Page 157(ii), section 31(1) of the bill. Same vote? That carries.
Page 157b, government motion, new motion, subsection 31(8) of the bill. Same vote? that carries.
Page 157c, government motion, subsection 31(9). Same vote? That carries.
On section 31, as amended, all in favour? Same vote? That carries.
On section 32, same vote? That carries.
Page 161, government motion, section 37 of the bill. Same vote.
On section 37, as amended? Same vote. That carries.
Page 164, government motion, section 41 of the bill. Same vote. That carries.
Page 165 is a Liberal motion, section 41 of the bill.
Same vote reversed.
Page 166 is a PC motion. This amendment is identical to the previous Liberal amendment, so this is out of order.
Section 41. That was a government motion, by the way, 164, that carried, so on section 41, as amended. All in favour? Carried.
Do you want a recorded vote on that again?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White, Mr Hayes.
The Chair: Page 168 is a replacement government motion. That's section 42 of the bill. Same vote? All right.
Section 42, as amended. Same vote.
Section 43. Same vote.
Page 169, government motion, section 43.1 of the bill. Same vote.
Section 44. Same vote.
Section 45. Same vote.
Page 171, government motion. Same vote.
Section 46 of the bill: It's a government motion, page 171. Same vote. That carries.
Section 46, as amended. Same vote. That carries.
Page 172 is a Liberal motion, section 47. Same vote reversed. Motion lost.
Page 173 is a government motion. Same vote reversed. That carries.
Section 47, as amended. Same vote. That carries.
Section 48. Same vote. That carries.
Section 49. Same vote. That carries.
Page 174 is a Liberal motion. Same vote reversed. That is defeated, then.
Page 175; it's a government motion, section 51 of the bill. All in favour? That's a recorded vote.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White, Mr Hayes.
The Chair: Opposed? You have to raise your hand, please. It's a recorded vote. You're asking for a recorded vote on this.
Mr Curling: Let me find my spot. This is 175, government motion.
Mr Hayes: He's in favour.
Clerk of the Committee: He's in favour? Mr Eddy?
The Chair: Mr Curling, sorry, it's a recorded vote.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Curling in favour also.
The Chair: That carries.
We are on page 176. It's a Liberal motion, section 51 of the bill. Same vote reversed. That is defeated.
Interjections.
The Chair: Let's call for a recorded vote so it's clear.
All in favour of the motion before us?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, McLean.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: The motion is defeated.
Page 177, Liberal motion, section 51 of the bill. All in favour of that motion?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That motion is defeated.
On section 51, as amended, all in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 180, replacement. I think we ruled that 178 and 179 were out of order. Okay?
Mr Curling: You ruled that one was out of order?
The Chair: We had ruled that already, yes. We're on pages 180 to 182. It's a government motion, section 52 of the bill. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean.
The Chair: This motion carries.
Page 184, Liberal motion.
Mr McLean: You haven't dealt with 179 yet.
The Chair: We did. It was out of order.
Mr McLean: I moved an amendment to that motion. I want that to read "20,000."
The Chair: Whatever amendment you made, Mr McLean, they were both out of order, okay?
Page 184, Liberal motion, section 52. All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That motion is defeated.
Mr Hayes: Thank you for your support, Allan.
Mr McLean: Is that 178?
Clerk of the Committee: No, 184.
Mr Curling: What we did was 184. You voted for it.
The Chair: No, he didn't.
Interjections.
The Chair: Section 52, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: Okay. It carries.
Page 185, government motion, section 53 of the bill, subsection 374(1). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
All in favour of section 53, as amended? Same vote?
Interjections: No.
The Chair: All in favour raise your hands, please.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 54. All in favour of section 54?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
1740
We're now on section 55. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: Section 56: All in favour?
Mr McLean: What page are we on?
The Chair: I did say we're on section 56 of the bill.
Clerk of the Committee: Page 71.
The Chair: All in favour of section 56?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: We're on section 57 now. All in favour of section 57?
Mr Stockwell: Don't you have a motion on 57?
The Chair: No, there are no amendments. All in favour of section 57?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on page 186, government motion, section 57.1 of the bill. All in favour? Same vote?
Mr Stockwell: No.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson, Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 58. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 187, government motion, section 59 of the bill.
Mr Gary Wilson (Kingston and The Islands): Same vote.
Mr Stockwell: No.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 59, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
All in favour of section 60?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 188, government motion, section 61 of the bill. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: All in favour of section 61, as amended?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
All in favour of section 62?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White, Mr Hayes.
The Chair: Opposed.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Stockwell.
Mr McLean: I'm in favour of it.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr McLean in favour.
Interjections.
Clerk of the Committee: Also in favour are Mr Stockwell, Mr Eddy, Mr Curling -- excuse me, Mr McLean was also in favour. Mr McLean in favour, Mr Stockwell opposed.
The Chair: It carries.
Page 189, government motion, section 62.1 of the bill: All in favour?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Wiseman, Mr Wilson, Ms Haeck, Mr Bisson, Mr White, Mr Hayes, Mr Eddy, Mr Curling.
The Chair: Opposed?
Mr McLean: I haven't read it yet.
The Chair: There's no time to read it now, Mr McLean.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Stockwell, Mr McLean.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 64. All in favour of section 64?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
We are now on section 65.
Clerk of the Committee: No, section 66.
The Chair: Oh, section 65 carried. Sorry. Section 66: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 189.
Clerk of the Committee: We've done that.
The Chair: We're on section 68 actually.
Mr Stockwell: What page?
Clerk of the Committee: No page, section 68 of the bill.
Mr Stockwell: Mr Chair, it's out of order here.
The Chair: Do we have a page?
Clerk of the Committee: No.
The Chair: Mr McLean is looking for a page number for section 68. Do we have a page? Page 74, Mr McLean.
All in favour of section 68?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 190.
Mr Curling: Mr Chairman, may I make a point here? I really feel very clumsy and awkward voting on this thing, because by the time I find what the dickens I'm voting for -- I know that they want me to vote, but by the time you move to 69 --
The Chair: We'll do our best to slow down.
Mr Stockwell: That's the lifestyle you've chosen.
The Chair: We're on page 190, Mr Curling, government motion, subsection 69(1). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 69, as amended. All in favour? Same vote?
Mr Stockwell: No, not same vote.
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: It's the same vote, don't you think, Mr Stockwell?
Page 191, government motion -- we dealt with that.
Clerk of the Committee: No, we didn't. Recorded vote; this is a different one.
The Chair: Okay, 191, section 70 of the bill. All in favour of section 70?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 71 now.
Mr Stockwell, let me ask you a question. Do you want to deal with those matters separately or completely from 71 to 84?
Mr Stockwell: No, I want -- you're asking me?
The Chair: Yes.
Mr Stockwell: Well, seeing as how you ask me, Mr Chair --
The Chair: No, no. Yes or no.
Mr Stockwell: Oh, I ask you that in the House all the time.
The Chair: I wanted to ask you whether we --
Mr Stockwell: Yes, deal with them individually.
The Chair: Section 71: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: Section 72: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 73: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 74: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
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The Chair: They're all in favour. It is unanimous, section 74. That carries.
We're on section 75. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 76: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 77: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 78: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 79: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 80: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 81: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 82: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 83: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 84: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
Mr McLean: I don't think we asked for a recorded vote on that one.
The Chair: We did, yes.
Clerk of the Committee: We asked for recorded votes on all of them. Mr McLean.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on page 192, government motion, subsection 85(1) of the bill. All in favour?
Interjection: Same vote.
The Chair: Same vote?
Interjection.
The Chair: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
Interjection: What are the Liberals --
The Chair: Hold on, please. Sorry. Mr Curling, Mr Eddy, you didn't vote on this matter.
Interjection.
The Chair: Page 192, subsection 85(1). Mr Eddy, do you have a vote?
Mr Eddy: Yes. I vote the same as Mr Curling.
The Chair: Mr Curling, yea or nay?
Clerk of the Committee: In favour, Mr Eddy and Mr Curling.
Mr Stockwell: It's hard to straddle the fence and keep both ears to the ground.
The Chair: This motion carries.
We're now on section 85, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 86: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 87. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: It carries.
Section 88: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 193, government motion, schedule A to the bill. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 194, government motion, schedule A to the bill, subsection 1(1): All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 195, government motion, schedule A to the bill, subsection 1(2): All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Are you taking all the schedule A's together and then voting as amended?
The Chair: That's right.
Clerk of the Committee: Yes, section by section.
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 1 now, as amended, of schedule A. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
Interjection.
The Chair: Schedule A.
Mr Stockwell: Oh, subsection 1(2) of the Ontario Planning and Development Act.
Mr McLean: You said you were on schedule 1.
The Chair: I said section 1, schedule A. Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 2. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on section 3. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Mr Stockwell: We want a 20-minute break.
The Chair: There's only one break.
Page 196, government motion, schedule A to the bill: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, McLean, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed? Mr Stockwell?
Mr Stockwell: We've done 196. I'm opposed because we've already done it.
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: We didn't do it. That carries, by the way.
Page 197, government motion, schedule A to the bill, clause 4(4)(c).
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
Mr Curling: Didn't we just do this?
Mr Hayes: It's different. It's clause 4(4)(c) instead of subsection 4(3).
Nays
Curling, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 4, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: We're on section 5. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're now on page 197a, government motion, schedule A to the bill, subsection 6(4). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 6 now, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, McLean, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Mr Curling: Wait a second. Where are you now?
The Chair: We're now on section 7. We voted on section 6, as amended.
Mr Stockwell: So 7 is coming after 6?
The Chair: Right. Section 7: All in favour?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Bisson, Ms Haeck, Mr Hayes, Mr White, Mr Wilson, Mr Wiseman.
Interjection.
The Chair: We're dealing with section 7. Some members have just voted in favour. Are you in favour of that, Mr Curling?
Mr McLean: We've got a problem.
The Chair: No, no, there's no problem.
Mr McLean: Yes, there is a problem.
The Chair: There isn't.
Mr McLean: You're just going too fast. You're not giving us time to deal with them properly.
The Chair: I couldn't go any slower, Mr McLean.
Mr McLean: I feel this is a very unfair situation that we're put in and I don't agree with it.
1800
The Chair: Okay. Section 7, by the way, is carried. We're now --
Mr Curling: We do have a problem. Even when we finish one, we have two different piles of things, and by the time we switch over there to find it, you move on to another one.
Interjections.
The Chair: We're on section 8 now. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: Mr Curling, your vote?
Mr Curling: I'll vote when I'm ready. What section is it?
The Chair: Section 8. You've got to vote, Mr Curling.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Curling, are you in favour?
The Chair: That carries. The rest of these other items carried.
Interjections.
The Chair: If you don't mind. Sections 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 and 14 are carried.
We're now on page 198, government motion schedule A to the bill, subsection 15(2).
Ayes
Bisson, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Curling, are you in favour?
Interjection.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries. We are now on section 15 now, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: It carries. We're on section 16 of the bill. All in favour of section 16?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
Mr Curling: Shouldn't we be doing 16.1 here, page 198a?
The Chair: We're dealing with section 16. It's a new section.
Clerk of the Committee: It's a new section and it will come after section 16.
The Chair: We've had members say they're in favour and now we're moving on to those who are opposed. Opposed?
Nays
Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Mr Curling, we're on to the section.
Interjections.
The Chair: That carries. We're on page 198a, government motion schedule A to the bill, section 16.1. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries. We are on page 199, government motion, schedule A to the bill, clause 18(2)(b). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Mr Stockwell: Do we need one on 17, sir?
The Chair: We had carried that motion earlier. We are now on section 18, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 200, government motion, schedule A to the bill, section 19. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 19, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
On section 20, all in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on page 200a, government motion, schedule A to the bill, subsection 21(3). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 200b, government motion, schedule A to the bill, subsection 21(4). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 21, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 22. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We are on schedule A, as amended. All in favour?
Mr Curling: I don't know where it is now.
The Chair: Does somebody have that page for schedule A?
Clerk of the Committee: It's the entire schedule, as amended.
Mr Stockwell: Schedule A?
The Chair: From what page?
Clerk of the Committee: Well, it's the whole schedule, as amended.
The Chair: It begins where to where?
Clerk of the Committee: It starts on page 77.
Mr Stockwell: That's as amended?
The Chair: As amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 1 of schedule B. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That's carried.
Page 203, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 2(2.1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Ms Haeck: Just a quick question: I had forgotten to mark down if motion 202 was carried.
Clerk of the Committee: That was previously carried.
The Chair: We're now on section 2, as amended.
Mr Stockwell: We did not go on to page 201 then, did we?
The Chair: It had carried previously.
1810
Mr Stockwell: It had previously carried, so there was no recorded vote on that one?
The Chair: That's right. We're on section 2, as amended, of schedule B. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 3 is carried.
We're on page 204, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(1). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 205, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 4(1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 206, government motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 4(1)(d). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 207, PC motion, schedule B to the bill. All in favour?
Mr Wiseman: Isn't that the same as the one we just did?
The Chair: It's slightly different, Mr Wiseman. Mr Stockwell, it's a PC motion. All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: Are you ruling it's in order?
The Chair: Yes.
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: This motion is defeated.
Page 208, Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 4(1.1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 209, government motion, schedule B to the bill. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: This motion carries.
Page 210, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill. All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: This motion is defeated.
Section 4, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 210a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 5(1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 211 is a Liberal motion, schedule B, section 5. All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: It's defeated.
We have a Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 5(3). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Section 5. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 213, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 6(4). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 214 I think was deferred. This is identical to the previous one, so this is out of order. We deferred it. This motion is out of order; it's identical to the previous one.
Mr Curling: The previous one --
The Chair: We're now on section 6, as amended. Your motion has been ruled out of order. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on page 215, government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 7(2). All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 216, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 7(4). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 217, Liberal motion, schedule B. All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Section 7, as amended, all in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 218, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 8(2.1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: This motion is defeated.
We're on page 218a, PC motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 8(8)(a). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 219, Liberal motion, schedule B to the bill, clause 8(8)(b). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 220, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsections 8(10), (11) and (12). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 221, schedule B, subsection 8(14).
Mr Stockwell: Which section?
The Chair: Schedule B of the bill, subsection 8(14). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 8 now. All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: As amended?
The Chair: No.
Mr Stockwell: Darn.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Motion carries.
Page 222, Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 9(1.1). All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
1820
Page 222a, a PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 9(1.1): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 223, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 9(2): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 9. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 223a, a PC motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 10(1): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 10. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 11. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 12: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 13: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 14: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on page 224, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsections 15(3) and (4): All in favour?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Stockwell.
The Chair: It's a Liberal motion.
Mr Eddy: Is there any chance to read it?
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Eddy.
Mr Curling: Is this the page 18?
The Chair: Subsections 15(3) and (4).
Mr Stockwell: You're in favour, Alvin; it's your motion.
The Chair: I think Mr Curling is in favour. It's your motion.
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Curling.
The Chair: Those opposed?
Nays
Clerk of the Committee: Mr Bisson, Ms Haeck, Mr Hayes, Mr White, Mr Wilson, Mr Wiseman.
The Chair: It's defeated.
Page 225, a PC motion, is an identical motion to the previous Liberal motion, so it's out of order.
Page 226, a government motion, schedule B to the bill, subsection 15(5): All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 15 now, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 16: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Curling, Eddy, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: It carries.
Page 226a, a PC motion, schedule B to the bill, section 17: All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: This motion is defeated.
We're on section 17. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, Stockwell, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 227, a Liberal motion, schedule B, subsection 18(1): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
Page 228, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill, subsection 18(1.1): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: It's defeated.
We're on section 18. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
NAYS
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That motion is defeated. Oh, sorry. This is section 18. That carries.
Mr Stockwell: Hold it. I thought it was defeated.
The Chair: No, I corrected myself.
Page 229, a Liberal motion, schedule B of the bill. We're on section 19 now. All in favour?
Mr Stockwell: What happened to the Liberal motion? Is that what you're doing right now?
The Chair: No, we're on section 19.
Mr Curling: I think you merged the wrong thing. You merged the instructions.
The Chair: Just instructions for the Liberal folks.
On section 19, all in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
Mr Curling: Mr Chairman, I just want to understand this. What is the motion?
The Chair: We're on section 19.
Mr Curling: But what is the motion?
The Chair: "All in favour?" "All opposed?"
Mr Stockwell: It's your own note: just read it. That's all you've got to do: vote against it.
The Chair: All opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 20: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
NAYS
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Section 21: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 230, a government motion, schedule B, clause 22(e): All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: The motion carries.
We're on section 22 now, as amended, of schedule B. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on section 24.
Mr Stockwell: No, 23.
The Chair: That carried before. Section 24: All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
We're on schedule B, as amended. All those in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and The Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Mr Stockwell: This vote is a complete joke.
The Chair: We are on page 18, a Liberal motion. There are still a few.
Mr Stockwell: What is it, 18?
The Chair: Section 7 of the bill, subsection 4(6): All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That's defeated.
We're now on section 7. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Page 67, a Liberal motion, section 10 of the bill, section 17.1: All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 10, as amended.
Mr Stockwell: Did you rule 68 out of order?
The Chair: No. It was a motion properly before us and it had lost.
We're on section 10, as amended. All in favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Section 10 carries, as amended.
Page 93, section 25 of the bill, subsection 45(12.1): This is the second 93, do you recall? All right. All in favour?
Ayes
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: That is defeated.
We're on section 25, as amended. In favour?
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Mr Bisson: I would like to ask for unanimous consent to open section 33 and subsection (21) of schedule B in order to go to section 33 and to reverse that vote. That was a section we wanted to withdraw from the bill, if we can deal with that by unanimous consent of the committee.
Mr Stockwell: Not a chance.
Mr Bisson: All right, then I would ask on subsection (21) of schedule B if we're able to reverse that vote. Can we have unanimous consent of the committee?
Mr Stockwell: No chance.
Mr Bisson: Thank you very much.
The Chair: Shall the title carry?
Interjections: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Mr Stockwell: No, I don't agree.
The Chair: Shall the bill, as amended, carry?
Mr Stockwell: No. Recorded vote.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: That carries.
Shall I report the bill, as amended, to the House?
Mr Stockwell: No. Recorded vote.
Ayes
Bisson, Haeck, Hayes, White, Wilson (Kingston and the Islands), Wiseman.
The Chair: Opposed?
Nays
Curling, Eddy, Stockwell.
The Chair: Is it ordered that the Chair report Bill 163, as amended, to the House?
Interjections: Agreed.
Mr Stockwell: No. Recorded vote.
The Chair: That's something we do automatically. I don't think we need a recorded vote.
This committee is adjourned.
The committee adjourned at 1835.